Swan 411 – Chain and Anchor Replacement: Advice

Dear Francesca,

on 411/009 Oracabessa there was a CQR (sorry, do not remember the size) with a 8  mm. chain, and they had a lot of holding problem, which ended when they switched to a 10 mm chain.

I remember perfectly well because Stefano (at the time owner of Oracabessa) gifted me the fantastic anchor hook made by Nautor (see attached pic) which did not fit anymore with his new 10 mm chain (I have now modified it to get it to the 10 mm chain I have on Vanessa).

Welcome onboard dear Francesca!

matteo (47/069 Vanessa)

Nautor anchor hook

Francesca.

When we purchased Hierro, we had 50m chain/warp with the standard CQR and Danforth anchors.

As you have found out the CQR is not the best anchor available today. We replaced ours with a 20 kilo Rocna. We chose this size as it fitted on the bow roller more easily than the larger size.I installed a windlass and 40m 10mm chain. I have kept the original chain/ warp onboard. The original chain is not calibrated for the windlass, but can be shackled to the main chain if necessary.We normally only need to anchor in shallow depths and have found with the Rocna that this is ok for us. With the seabed we anchor over around UK and West Coast of France, the Rocna is much more reliable.         Hope this helps.

Paul Bond

Thank you Matteo and Paul for the information. I am now convinced to purchase a 10 mm (Grade 7) chain and a Rocna anchor, still to decide whether 20 or 25 kg depending on how it fits on the bow roller.

I am still uncertain about the chain length, since 50 meters seems too short and 75 perhaps too long. I will check if any supplier can provide 60 or 65 meters, which would be ideal.

Dear Francesca,

I would think changing to the stronger (=heavier) chain will be the main factor. After all, it is the chain that holds the boat (or rather, the weight of the chain), and the anchor only holds the chain. 

The length of chain required when anchoring can be calculated by mathematical formulas. There's even an app using the formula ("anchor chain calculator"), so with a general idea of the conditions you expect you can estimate the length you need to carry. If I had had the app before fitting out Vellamo with 75m of 10mm chain, I would most likely have bought less, even though I am nowadays sailing in Norway and seldom find shallow beaches. 15-23m of water is more common.

Some suppliers have lenghts of 50m in stock and simply combine (e.g., 1+.2 for 60m), using a safety link. Others provide you with a welded chain in the requested length -- I'd suggest the latter approach, as I think the safety link is a weak spot. 

The anchor is a different question. Vellamo had a 30 kg CQR that was very difficult to get to dig in. When I decided to replace it, I checked all the test reports that were then available on the web and found that three types of anchor consistently appear in the top ranks. I recall the Rocna and the German Bügel anchor but not number 3. My choice was a 30kg Bügel then, but it also helps to check around what seems to be the most common type in your region -- it is likely to be the best suited for the typical sea bottom in that area. That's why I currently use a 30kg anchor that is somewhere between a Bruce and a whale's fluke in shape.

If you want to discuss more aspects, I'll be happy to. Best regards,

Martin (Vellamo, 48/039)

Hi Francesca, 

we have a 25kg Vulcan on our 411, with 50m 10mm chain. See here for a photo: https://www.classicswan.org/forum/post_thread.php?thread=780&nopage=1

The Vulcan, which is also from Rocna, is self-launching, which means I can lower and lift it from the cockpit with the remote. The 50m are tight in Greece where you anchor in the harbor. The anchor itself is a considerable improvement over the CQR. It usually holds at the first attempt, tested in the Meltemi this summer. I selected the Vulcan after having watched SV Panope anchor tests on YouTube.

Kind regards,

Christian 411/028 IF

Do you have the original bow roller or has it ever been replaced? Ours is still the original one, and I wanted to know whether you have experienced any issues with the Vulcan Rocna on it.

Do you have the original bow roller or has it ever been replaced? Ours is still the original one, and I wanted to know whether you have experienced any issues with the Vulcan Rocna on it.

Sorry, my message was for Christian - IF